December 25, 2011

Ken Lokken vs. the Gospel, pt. 2

Posted in Anthony Buzzard, Ken Lokken tagged , , , , , , , , at 4:00 AM by chriswadams

A few months ago, I had an e-mail exchange with a group of people, led by Anthony Buzzard and Ken Lokken. What follows is my second post to that e-mail group.

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Ken —

First of all, I notice that you utterly *failed* to do the one thing I asked you to do: interact with the *Scripture references* I provided. Was that too hard, or just beneath you, Ken? Your pontifications on what the Kingdom of God is all about are utterly *meaningless* without some grounding in Scripture. Yet that is the one thing you have failed to provide. Disgraceful.

You wrote: “Jesus Christ, the human Messiah began his actual existence on earth.  He is not the so called 2nd person of the trinity and neither was he a pre-existent spirit”

But contrary to this, Jesus said, “And now Father, glorify Me with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the existence of the world. ” (Joh 17:5) and “Jesus said to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham came into being, I AM.” (Joh 8:58) Either Ken Lokken is right or Jesus Christ is right; it can’t be both.

You also wrote: “Finite man cannot commit infinite sin.”

ALL sins are infinitely heinous, not because of the infinite glory of man, but because of the infinite glory of GOD. When man offends an infinite God, that sin is an infinite sin. The fact that you can’t see that shows that you have absolutely no understanding of God’s glory; your puny little god only needs man’s tears of repentance to be appeased. The true God of the Bible needs the blood of his only begotten Son, the divine mediator between God and Man, to appease his wrath over sin. That is why I say that you have committed blasphemy in preaching that Jesus was merely human, and not God in the flesh. With no understanding of the infinite glory of God, the infinite heinousness of sin, and the need for an infinite atonement for those sins, you show that you have no understanding of the true Gospel. You are lost, Ken, and your deeds are evil; you are dead in your sins. Repent and believe the Gospel.

You wrote: “The Gospel is the good news of the Messiah and his future Kingdom on earth.  It was all Jesus talked about.  Only just before his closing days did he even mention that the son of man must suffer to cleanse his people from their sins. ”

Really? So why was the Christ-child given the name “Jesus” in Mat 1:21? Was it because he would “usher in the Kingdom on earth”? NO. The name “Jesus” means “Jehovah saves”, and we are specifically told that he would save his people “FROM THEIR SINS”. So, nice try on the obfuscation, but it doesn’t work. Here is the true definition of the Gospel:

The gospel is God’s promise to save His people, giving them all the blessings of salvation from regeneration to final glory, conditioned exclusively on the atoning blood and imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ, totally apart from the sinner’s works and efforts. It reveals the righteousness of God – how God is just to justify the ungodly based on the work of Jesus Christ alone. The gospel is not merely the fact that Jesus lived, died, and rose again, considered apart from the purpose of these truths, which were accomplished to establish a righteousness for all whom Jesus represented. [Gen 15:5-6; Psa 103:2-12; 130:3-4; Isa 1:18; 45:21-25; Jer 33:14-16; Mat 1:21; Joh 3:16; Act 13:32-39; Rom 1:16-17; 3:21-26; 4:5-8,13-25; 10:4,15; 1Co 15:1-8; 2Co 1:20; 5:21; Eph 1:3-2:22; 3:6; Col 1:5; 2Ti 1:1,9-10; Heb 10:4-17] (Christian Confession of Faith V.B.1, http://www.outsidethecamp.org/ccfv.htm )

Next, you asked: “Can God die? ”

Answer: YES.

17 And when I saw Him, I fell at His feet as dead. But He laid His right hand on me, saying to me, “Do not be afraid; I am the First and the Last. 18 I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore. Amen. And I have the keys of Hades and of Death. (Rev 1:17-18)

And if you doubt that the speaker is God Almighty, see how he introduces himself in verse 9: “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last,” Compare Isa 41:4; 44:6; 48:12.

You also wrote: “I am saying a perfect human Jew became our savior.  Tell me just how would God incarnate?  To do so would make him less than God.  Fully God/fully man is neither fully God or fully man. ”

Have you ever even READ a New Testament?! This is basic stuff, Ken!

“41 While the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them, 42 saying, “What do you think about the Christ? Whose Son is He?”
They said to Him, “ The Son of David.” 43 He said to them, “How then does David in the Spirit call Him ‘Lord,’ saying:
44 ‘ The LORD said to my Lord,
“ Sit at My right hand,
Till I make Your enemies Your footstool”’?
45 If David then calls Him ‘Lord,’ how is He his Son?” 46 And no one was able to answer Him a word, nor from that day on did anyone dare question Him anymore. ”

The Pharisees couldn’t answer Jesus’ question, and neither can you, Ken.

Jesus was fully God and fully Man because he was begotten by the Holy Spirit, and born of a virgin. He partook of both the human and divine natures. Hebrews 2:9 says that Jesus was “was made a little lower than the angels”. How is that even possible if Jesus is merely a man? ALL men are lower than the angels, so how was Jesus “made” a little lower? Hebrews 2:17 says “Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. ” If Jesus was merely human, then he was ALREADY like his brothers; so how was he “made” to be like his brothers?

You also wrote: “I am not as wise as you theologians; but neither am I looking through your lenses which I am most familiar with.  ”

Yeah, you’re just so exceedingly humble, Ken. Keep blowing that trumpet, so the whole world can gather around and see just how wildly humble you are.

Go read the Gospel of Matthew, chapter 23. Was Jesus being humble when he called the Pharisees vipers, whitewashed tombs, and sons of the Devil?

(Here’s a hint: YES, he WAS being humble.)

You wrote: “Perhaps you should at least give mine a try? You pride yourself in being a Berean.  To search the scriptures means just that.  It does not mean to uphold a bias.”

Yet, you are perfectly willing to NOT search the Scriptures, and uphold YOUR bias. As long as you’re going to live in that glass house, you should probably keep the stones to yourself. Oh, and please, please, close the curtains, Ken. Please.

As for “Focus on the Kingdom”, yeah, I might have some fun refuting their nonsense. But then, I have already written a pair of articles on the divinity of Jesus Christ: ‘A Christian View of the Messiah‘, and ‘An Open Letter to a Jehovah’s Witness‘. If you are as open minded as you seem to think you are (or as open minded as you expect me to be), you will go read them. Of course I’m not holding my breath.

In regard to the section of the Confession dealing with the divinity of Christ, you wrote:”(I do not recognise your confession of faith based on haphazard scripture.  Anyone can take a group of scriptures and make them what they want them to appear.  the OT and the new agree as one.  Hear o’ Isreal the Lord thy God is one Lord.  Tell Moses who knew God face to face that God is 3 persons, or the prophets that the Messiah would be God himself in the flesh.  Paul the great theologian never said grace, mercy and peace from god the father, god the son and god the holy ghost.  It was always grace, mercy peace from God the Father of OUR lord Jesus Christ(Messiah).  In the early church they argued over many issues..the diety of Jesus nor the teaching of trinity ever came up.  salvation is of the Jews and no Jew would have thought Jesus the messiah as God..much less that God was 3 persons in one) “

I don’t care whether you recognize the Confession, Ken; that isn’t why I quoted it. What I was doing was putting forth the truth of this doctrine (the deity of Christ) as it has already been formulated. And if the Scripture references are so haphazard and misinterpreted, then why don’t you SHOW US that, instead of asking us to take your word for it? Show us how the Scripture references are misused or misinterpreted, Ken. Then you might have something resembling an argument. Apparently that’s just to much to ask for.

As for Deuteronomy 6:4 “”, here is what John Gill had to say about the passage:

” In an ancient book of theirs it is said {o} Jehovah, Elohenu, Jehovah (i.e. Jehovah, our God, Jehovah); these are the three degrees with respect to this sublime mystery; “in the beginning God (Elohim) created the heavens and the earth”; and again {p}, Jehovah, Elohenu, Jehovah, they are one; the three forms (modes or things) which are one; and elsewhere {q} it is observed, there are two, and one is joined to them, and they are three; and when the three are one, he says to (or of) them, these are the two names which Israel heard, Jehovah, Jehovah, and Elohenu (our God) is joined unto them; and it is the seal of the ring of truth, and when they are joined they are one in one unity; which is illustrated by the three names the soul of man is called by, the soul, spirit, and breath; and elsewhere they say {r} the holy blessed God, and his Shechinah, are called one; see Joh 10:30. {o} Zohar in Gen. fol. 1, 3. {p} Ib. in Exod. fol. 18. 3, 4. {q} Ib. in Numb. fol. 67. 3. {r} Tikkune Zohar, Correct. 47. fol. 86. 2.Ç”

So, yeah, I’m pretty sure Moses would have no problem agreeing that God is a triune being (ie. three in ONE).

Here is some of what I wrote in the article ‘An Open Letter to a Jehovah’s Witness‘ :

God is an infinite God and an infinitely righteous God. Therefore, all sin is an infinite offense to him (Exodus 20:5, Habakkuk 1:13). Therefore, any sacrifice that is intended to atone for sin must be an infinite sacrifice. Anything less would be insufficient to turn away God’s wrath against the sins of his people. It is only as Jesus Christ partakes of the two natures, human and divine, that he is able to become the Mediator between God and Man (Job 9:33; Hebrews 2:17), able to “lay his hand” upon both at once. Therefore, the Gospel absolutely requires that Jesus Christ not only be a real human being but also be God incarnate, God in the flesh.

The fact that Jesus is more than a mere “creature” is inferred from the following facts:

1. Several titles applied to Jesus Christ. Jesus is called “Lord”, by Thomas and Stephen (John 20: 28, Acts 7:59-60), and Christians must confess Jesus as “Lord” (Romans 10:9, 1 Corinthians 12: 3). The Greek word here translated “Lord” is kurios, which is the word used to translate “Jehovah” in the Greek version of the Old Testament.

Similarly, Jesus is called “Immanuel” (Matthew 1:23), which means “God with us.” And in Revelation 22:13, Jesus is called “the first and the last,” a title that is given to Jehovah God in Isaiah 44:6. None of these titles could be given to a mere creature.

2. Several attributes of Jesus Christ. Jesus is described as all-knowing (John 1:48; 2:25; 6:64; 16:30; 21:17), all-powerful (Matthew 28:18; Hebrews 1:3), eternal (Micah 5:2), and unchanging (Hebrews 13:8). And Colossians 2:9 states that in Jesus Christ “all the fullness of the divine quality dwells bodily.” (NWT). None of these things can be said of a mere creature.

3. Several works of Jesus Christ. Jesus has the power to forgive sins (Mark 2:5-7; Luke 5:24; Ephesians 1:7), control nature (Matthew 8:26), give eternal life (John 10:28; 17:2), and judge the world (John 5:22 & 27). None of these things can be done by a mere creature.

4. Jesus Christ received worship. Jesus received worship from men (Matthew 14:33; John 9:38) and angels (Hebrews 1:6, Revelation 5:11-13). Yet worship is due to God alone (Exodus 34:14; Acts 14:11-18; Romans 1:24-25; Revelation 19:10). Jesus himself even taught this (Matthew 4:10; John 4:23). No mere creature can legitimately receive worship.

5. The Patriarchs and Prophets expected a Messiah who would also be Jehovah. The Messiah was expected to be not only David’s son, but his Lord as well (Psalm 110:1). Job said “For I know my Redeemer [is] living, and He shall rise on the earth at the last; and after my skin has been struck off from my flesh, yet this, I shall see God” (Job 19:25-26). John wrote of Jesus in John 12:37-41 that Isaiah “saw His glory, and spoke about Him.” (cf. Isaiah 6:1-5). The Patriarchs and Prophets did not expect that the Messiah would be a mere creature.

Finally, there is Revelation 1: 11-18. In this section, John sees a vision of a person who clearly identifies himself as Jehovah God (vss. 11,14,17). He also has the appearance of a “Son of Man” (v. 13). But this person goes on to say, in v. 18, “I became dead.” So how could Jehovah God die? The only possible explanation is that Jehovah God died on a Roman cross, just outside Jerusalem.

You wrote: “Your very statement tells me you have absolutely no idea what the gospel is all about.  the death, buriel, ressurrection are one of the primary things concerning the Kingdom Of God.”

Oh, so I “have absolutely no idea what the gospel is all about”, eh? Does this mean that I am LOST, Ken? But since I know you don’t have the spine to judge me lost, what is the point of telling me about your view of the Kingdom? If I will be going to heaven no matter what I believe about the Gospel, what is the point of preaching it, or correcting me on my misunderstanding of it?

You are lost, Ken, and so is everyone who believes this damnable heresy. I can say that with absolute certainty because of Mat 7:20. Repent and believe the Gospel.

December 18, 2011

Ken Lokken vs. the Gospel, pt. 1

Posted in Anthony Buzzard, Ken Lokken tagged , , , , , , , at 4:00 AM by chriswadams

A few months ago, I had an e-mail exchange with a group of people, led by Anthony Buzzard and Ken Lokken. Ken initiated the exchange. What follows is my first post to that e-mail group.

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Ken —

What did you mean when you wrote this:

“At the appointed time Jesus (that Messiah) was born of the virgin Mary supernaturally. The announcement was made by an angel to Mary that she would give birth to a son.  Mary not knowing a man asked how.  The angel said that the holy Spirit of God would come upon her.  That God himself would be his father and for that reason he shall be called the son of God.  At that precise Jesus began his existence.”

I’m especially curious about that last sentence. There seems to be a word missing, and from the context it seems to be the word ‘moment’. If so, then the full sentence reads “At that precise [moment,] Jesus began his existence.” If you intended to add a different word please say so.

If Jesus began his existence at the moment he was conceived, then he was not God in the flesh. If he was not God in the flesh, then his sacrifice of himself on the cross was not of infinite value, and therefore insufficient to atone for the infinitely heinous sins of his people. This is blasphemy.

God’s “program” for his people is not merely to give them something to do, or even something to look forward to. His “program” is to cleanse them from their sins:

The gospel is God’s promise to save His people, giving them all the blessings of salvation from regeneration to final glory, conditioned exclusively on the atoning blood and imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ, totally apart from the sinner’s works and efforts. It reveals the righteousness of God – how God is just to justify the ungodly based on the work of Jesus Christ alone. The gospel is not merely the fact that Jesus lived, died, and rose again, considered apart from the purpose of these truths, which were accomplished to establish a righteousness for all whom Jesus represented.[Gen 15:5-6; Psa 103:2-12; 130:3-4; Isa 1:18; 45:21-25; Jer 33:14-16; Mat 1:21; Joh 3:16; Act 13:32-39; Rom 1:16-17; 3:21-26; 4:5-8,13-25; 10:4,15; 1Co 15:1-8; 2Co 1:20; 5:21; Eph 1:3-2:22; 3:6; Col 1:5; 2Ti 1:1,9-10; Heb 10:4-17] (Christian Confession of Faith V.B.1, http://www.outsidethecamp.org/ccfv.htm )

But your version of God’s “program” is good news to NO ONE, because there is no divine savior, and therefore no atoning blood, no imputed righteousness, and no “blessings of salvation from regeneration to final glory“.

You go on to confirm that you don’t believe in the divine nature of Jesus Christ, when you write:

“Jesus who alone has immortal life, who alone is a glorified man in heaven, is now waiting, …”

Without a savior who is God Incarnate, there is simply no good news:

Jesus of Nazareth is really and truly God as well as really and truly human. He is the only descendant of Adam with two natures, human and divine. These two natures are continually without confusion, without change, without division, and without separation. Scripture rejects the lie that Jesus Christ was merely human and not fully divine. It likewise rejects the lie that Jesus Christ was a supernatural being but not fully human. [Deu 18:15; Psa 2:7; 110:1; Isa 9:6; Luk 2:7; Joh 1:1,14,18; 3:16,18; 5:18; 8:58; 10:30-33; Act 20:28; Rom 1:3; 1Co 15:47; Gal 4:4; Phi 2:6-8; Col 1:15; 1Ti 3:16; Tit 2:13; Heb 1:1-5; 5:5; 1Jo 4:9,15; Rev 1:17-18](Christian Confession of Faith IV.A.2, http://www.outsidethecamp.org/ccfiv.htm )

Jesus Christ is the only mediator between God and men, for He alone has partaken of both the divine and human natures and is alone able to lay His hand upon both God and Man. Scripture rejects the lie that Mary or any “saints” mediate between God and men. [Job 9:32-33; Isa 53:12; Zec 6:13; Luk 23:34; Joh 14:6; Act 4:12; Rom 5:1-2; Eph 2:14-18; 1Ti 2:5; Heb 4:15; 9:15; 10:19-20; 12:24] (Christian Confession of Faith IV.D.1, http://www.outsidethecamp.org/ccfiv.htm )

If you (or anyone else on this cc list) would like to respond, I would welcome the exchange. But I ask that you make some effort to deal with the Scripture references I have put forth here (a job which you utterly failed to do in your original post — a sad commentary on a post that was supposed to be about “the message of God’s kingdom”).

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